Give help. Get help.

  • # September 27, 2013 at 12:16 pm

    When someone uses shitty font!

    # September 27, 2013 at 12:45 pm

    We want them to be at ease when reading and unfortunately Helvetica was not designed for this.

    While I agree with you for the most part, @chrisburton, I think that comment is misleading. If Helvetica is difficult to read at small font sizes then I’d say the solution isn’t to find a different typeface, it’s to make sure your using Helvetica properly.

    # September 27, 2013 at 10:15 pm


    Some good examples of Helvetica (and Arial) on screen…

    I can’t disagree with Arial even if it is a poor copy of Helvetica. It was specifically designed for the screen but in my opinion, not my cup of tea. However, your argument for Helvetica is not strong. While it may be “good” for you does not hold true for everyone (especially those with disabilities). You may want to read the statistical facts presented via the link that was posted. Now, no one is stopping you from using it but there are far better alternatives.


    Yeah, in print.

    To the rest, I’ll leave it here with a quote from Stephen Coles:

    “Some typefaces are simply not optimal for reading at small sizes, regardless of render quality or substrate. It has to do with weight, spacing, openness of letterforms, and most importantly rhythm. Neue Helvetica is known for its strict uniformity. This makes it appealing for big, graphic stuff like headlines, posters, and logos, but does not make it a great text or UI face.”

    # September 29, 2013 at 9:00 pm

    Not sure why that was double posted…I never did that intentinially…actually I didnt even do that…weird

    hmm – I’ve noticed some on-and-off problems like that (e.g., posting a comment, which doesn’t show up, but I can’t try again because the forum says it’s a dupe). Just today, in another thread, @Melindrea had an issue with one of her posts disappearing (and then later reappearing after she re-posted it).


    # September 30, 2013 at 6:59 pm


    Same here.

    # October 2, 2013 at 6:35 pm

    I’m starting to think the thread starter is long gone.

    Well, you can’t expect a guy named Joe_Temp to hang around forever.

    # October 6, 2013 at 9:26 am

    Hi! I know this thread might be dead but I thought I would give some input as well since it might help someone. You see, when working with type it all boils down to licensing of the font-files rather than the typeface itself. A typeface in itself cannot be copyrighted and in theory if you were to trace a typeface by hand and make your own font file out of it you could use this font as much as you like without paying royalties, even without alterations. A lot of typefaces have done this and are largely based on older typefaces two famous examples of this is Arial which is modified version of Helvitica and Helvitica itself which is based on some 1800s Grotesk typeface which’s name eludes me. Wiki it for a good read some day.

    This means that there are actually a rather large amount of typefaces floating around that are identical to Helvitica but are named differently since the name is trademarked. What I would do on a zero budget is to look around on opensource font sites and find a good Helvetica clone and simply use it. A lot of them have pretty good kerning and ligature. Check out: , or sites like .

    Also, Helvetica isn’t that great, to me it feels so corporate and Orwellian that I can hardly stand to look at it and when designers constantly resorts to standardized defaults it just looks so dead.

    # October 6, 2013 at 1:31 pm


    Are you referring to Neue Haas Grotesk? I only know that by having studied Font Bureau’s typefaces. (

    Keep in mind that this is a multinational forum. Some countries do respect copyright for typefaces. Also, in the United States, the software (font) itself is protected under copyright and so are the outlines (see Adobe vs SSI).

    # October 6, 2013 at 1:56 pm

    Yes. Neue Haas Grotesk seems to be the one.
    And you’re absolutely right, the copyright is really complex especially since even in places where typefaces cannot be copyrighted they can still be trademarked like the cocacola or general electrics logos or contain glyphs or dingbats which can be copyrighted. So be careful! Get lawyers to check everything! Or at least read the wikipedia entry on it.
    But as a vague rule of thumb free fonts are safe to use on images and if it has an open license it should be ok to embed, even if it is a clone.

    # October 6, 2013 at 3:13 pm

    Exactly. Always consult with a lawyer for these sort of things. It is better to invest in legal fees rather than pay an individual or company compensation from a lawsuit.

    # November 18, 2013 at 7:44 pm

    Linotype limits the number of page views! You can only license the font for a certain number of visitors

    What about if using cufon YUI?

    # November 18, 2013 at 7:49 pm

    Why would you use Cufon? We have come a long way since Cufon.

    # November 18, 2013 at 8:02 pm

    i have helvetica fonts, but not used for web..

    if i want to use it for web, what will happen after exceeding the limit of page views?

    # November 18, 2013 at 8:16 pm

    Don’t use Helvetica? There are far better alternatives if you’re looking for a sans-serif.

    To answer your question specifically, it depends on the webfont distributor you choose to use. Check their terms of service.

    # November 20, 2013 at 3:12 am

    Harriet from Webtype.

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